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🌐 English support #7758
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@mawek From my personal experience both devs can be contacted via English language w/out any problems (they both speak it very well and it's not like English for runaways). SiYuan's Discourse server offers an English speakers room, issues submitted here at Github can also be written down in English. Nonetheless my absolute pro-tip is: Just start using SiYuan! You'll soon discover new features (you can call it batteries included as it offers so much features out of the box), setup S3 backup and synchronization to different devices (if you use e.g. desktop application and a self-hosted docker-based instance) and you're ready to go. SiYuan syncs your notes in the background and you can restore snapshots of your notes any time in case something breaks. Enjoy using this great tool. It's a game changer, trust me. |
I don't dispute anything you said. Nevertheless, it's still hard to commit to it. Community and visibility is important for such tools. For example - in logseq (or any other similar tool) I often like wonder around to see what's going on, to check roadmap, check what issues it solved lately, how is development proceedeing, whether it aims for stability and bugfixes, or just adding new features,.. I like to read forums and see how other users interact with it. I need to gain confidence that it's not just some one-man show that might stop working in one year (I'm not saying this is the case) I can use translator here and there (to translate some selection via deepl chrome extension for example) but it doesn't work seamlessly. I personally had used few note taking apps in the past, always migrating all data to something new "better", so now I'm cautious and i think twice before i migrate again :) I don't expect that you rewrite everything to english or anything. I just wanted to share my 2 cents on this. |
Thanks for sharing your views, as one of the developers, let me briefly describe our situation. Another core developer @Vanessa219 is my wife, we are currently living in Yunnan Province, China. In the almost 3 years since SiYuan was created, we have spent a lot of time on architecture design and code implementation, so we have no time to think about internationalization. Everything is done as quickly as possible, including code comments and change logs, community discuss and so on. To be honest, judging from the current degree of completion of SiYuan, we did not expect to attract the attention of foreign users, because there are many projects that are much better than SiYuan on the international stage, and SiYuan still has a long way to go. So we still have to concentrate on technology at present, and the community relies on users to build spontaneously. Maybe in the near future, we will establish a separate English discussion forum similar to ld246.com, and provide subscription services in non-mainland China. Before that, you are welcome to communicate in English on GitHub Issues. We also hope that SiYuan users (including Chinese users) can use English on GitHub Issues, which is conducive to the development and growth of SiYuan, thank you. |
@88250 "because there are many projects that are much better than SiYuan" |
I'm chiming in here, hoping you would reconsider the internationalization aspect.
At the end, I understand the constraints of time by a small team and your astute focus on carving out a niche in the Chinese-speaking community. I heard that Logseq's Chinese community is too anemic that some have to flee to the English community and use a Translator to ask for help (The quality of its English community is also not great though. Logseq devs are no longer responsive to users' feedback as before). Obsidian also started with just 2 people and they have been quite involved with the community, but gradually they were able to build a strong volunteer community that helped them a lot. I do think there's a gap in the market for your app, so I hope you would consider doing a few things that would at least not scaring away non-Chinese users and developers. I didn't even know the main team has 2 devs and speak English fluently until today. Maybe starting with curating a few Chinese tutorials that clearly showcase the special features of the app and translating them into English? |
I agree with your point of view that the development of widgets, plugins and various usage methods for Simplenote requires |
I agree with the conversations above. SiYuan with its great quality absolutely worth a larger community including users other than Chinese. And we definitely need to build a community in English for non-Chinese speakers. Migrating between double-linked notes are diffcult, so maybe we should begin now and I'm glad to help. I list some TODOs here and maybe we can start here.
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Hi @88250, I can help with managing/monitoring the Discord community and the Twitter account + potentially creating a Mastodon account (I won't do much though for all of these, but I will keep them alive). I have DM'ed you on Discord and another 2 moderators. Let's find a place somewhere (perferably the mod channel in the current SiYuan's Discord server?) to make a plan about this. |
@nhan000 First of all, thank you for your enthusiasm, but I have to explain a few things:
After these steps have been implemented for a period of time, we will see if we can attract more international friends to help us improve this project, and then we will formally establish an official English discussion forum. The more optimistic expectation is that after the internationalization of the project is successful, we will further consider open source commercialization, that is, provide official cloud services in non-mainland China regions and start selling subscriptions. The current general plan is as follows:
In short, the most important thing is internationalizing the GitHub repo first. After all, the technical implementation is the foundation of everything, thank you. |
I closed this issue, but we are still welcome to continue discussing the details of SiYuan's internationalization, thank you. |
Appreciate D and V again for their great work! I agree with D's comment above, we can first internationalize the GitHub repository as it is easier and can provide useful information for the non-Chinese community. I have noticed that some issues' titles have been translated to English by D, which is really impressive. I have a small suggestion when translating the repo - maybe we should keep both Chinese and English titles when internationalizing? The Chinese titles are also important for users to search for information. Meanwhile, I wonder if there exists some ways for us, the community, to help internationalize the GitHub repo as it is a lot of work as we love this product. Some idea: maybe we can use some tools like github actions or github bot as some translation groups to automatically translate the commit msg and the titles to reduce the workload. |
I'd chime in here as well:
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Maybe we can use the 'github discussion' as the English community forum and keep 链滴 as Chinese community forum? |
Perhaps we should keep this issue open for better discussion? |
@nhan000 I agree with you, SiYuan Chinese users currently account for the vast majority, we cannot prevent the use of Chinese Feedback Issues for the sake of internationalization. For this reason, I think a more compromise solution is to establish a separate Chinese repo for issues. If there is a Chinese issue feedback on the main repo, we will move the Chinese issue to the Chinese repo, which can not only keep track, but also bring better internationalization/localization experience. Of course, we still need to discuss with the Chinese community users whether it is necessary to do so before implementing it. Maybe we can communicate on ld246.com or use English on GitHub Issues, so there is no need for an additional Chinese repo :) |
This comment was marked as off-topic.
This comment was marked as off-topic.
We're closing this issue first, and will keep it pinned on Issues for a while. |
Just a quick update:
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@88250 , I just discovered SiYuan and am very excited about it. I joined the Official English Forum at https://liuyun.io/ but am unable to post my questions because it seems like I need “20 ask rewards points” in order to post?!? So I am asking this question here: What are “ask points” and how can I get them? In general, I think it is a pleasant and positive user experience if they can create an account on the English forum and start asking questions immediately, without having to get any “ask points”. So please consider this. |
@sagarbehere Hello, please send us your forum username so that we can diagnose the problem. If it is not convenient to make it public, you can send it to the email address 845765@qq.com. Thank you. |
在什么情况下你需要该特性?In what scenarios do you need this feature?
I'm logseq user and I'm looking for alternatives.
This project seems interesting feature-wise, but what bothers me the most is lack of english resources.
Though main page and readmes are in english, all other resources are not - issues, communities, discussion..
Therefore, as playground it is very nic, but it's hard to commit to it since long term support is kind of hard requirements in such tools.
描述可能的最优解决方案 Describe the optimal solution
The best solution solution would be switching to english completely - not sure how viable this is :)
描述候选的解决方案 Describe the candidate solution
No response
其他信息 Other information
No response
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